Surprise!!
Did anyone think for even a moment that this illegitimate “supreme” court would rule in good faith? This court serves only conservatives and billionaires.
This court is a conservative roach motel. It should be tossed into the deepest part of the garbage.
Let’s burn this mother down, pookie!
I wonder who else decided that rioting was a good response to not getting your way….
Hmmm….
It’s also not only too conservative, it’s too religious.
deleted by creator
In what warped reality is the President of the United States not “an officer of the US”? The amendment was literally made for this exact situation.
It makes less than zero sense that the drafters and ratifiers of the amendment meant to leave the highest office in the nation out of the purview of the amendment. Absolute horseshit.
Pretty disappointing to see the comments from some of the more liberal justices…
Not only is what you’re saying obviously correct, but THE PEOPLE WHO VOTED IN THE FUCKING AMENDMENT was asked about this exact lack of the word “president”, and pointed to the officer line, and said that clearly included the president.
It’s also worth noting that there was just a single reference in the Senate debate to the fact that the president and vice president were not explicitly mentioned in Howard’s draft as “officer(s) of the United States,” the way members of Congress and state officials had been itemized in the text. Would the disqualification clause of the amendment not cover the top posts in the executive branch?
“Why did you omit to exclude them?” asked Maryland Democratic Sen. Reverdy Johnson.
Maine’s Lot Morrill jumped in to clarify.
“Let me call the Senator’s attention to the words ‘or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States,’” Morrill said, ending the discussion on that point.
presidential office is both, its listed twice
It sounds to me like they are going to weasel out of it by saying the Colorado Supreme Court doesn’t have the authority to make that decision for everyone.
Which they didn’t.
The Colorado Supreme Court ruled that Trump is disqualified and cannot appear on the Colorado ballots. The Colorado Supreme Court does have that authority, because the Colorado state legislature gave it to them and nothing in federal law says they don’t. Colorado had previously disqualified another candidate, and the judge who determined they could was Neil Gorsuch.
There is no question as to whether the President is an officer of the United States. There is no question as to whether his oath to uphold and defend the constitution is also an oath to support the constitution. There is no question as to whether the actions on January 6th were an insurrection, as several participants have already been convicted of seditious conspiracy. There is no question as to whether Trump supported them, because he live tweeted his support to the world in real time. There is no question as to whether Trump needs to be convicted, because the amendment never mentions conviction, and none of the other people previously disqualified under this amendment from office were convicted of anything.
None of these arguments holds even the faintest hint of water. They are bad faith arguments made by political hacks with a predetermined agenda to support Trump. The court is illegitimate, and we have no functional justice system.
None of these arguments holds even the faintest hint of water.
And guess how much they care for this? They are not neutral, they don’t follow the law, they just “interpret” it to follow their political agenda. Just compare their deposits and transcripts before they were voted into the office, and their deeds afterwards. The three judges called by Trump are a disgrace to the office if there ever was one.
Just the notion that people label them as “conservative” or “republican” judges shows that they are lacking keys requirement for the job: objectivity and neutrality.
While you’re correct, SCOTUS will most likely rule on the basis of this being “too politicized” and write some vague motions to support it. “Officer of the US” is just one of the many avenues they can take. It’s not the first time they’ve skirted controversial rulings this way.
Tbf it’s also worked in reverse to uphold lower court rulings affirming civil rights, etc in the past too. Right or wrong, it’s a “how the sausage is made” moment for the Judiciary Branch.
To be clear: I personally believe not upholding the Colorado/Maine, etc rulings to be a failure of our systems of checks and balances. Just pointing out the mechanism behind the court’s choices.
They could be taking an absurdly and ultimately pointless stance that primaries aren’t covered by the constitution and his presence is meaningless on the ballot of a private group. It would allow Trump on the primary ballot and still give the option for blocking him in the general election, or more likely the electors ballot.
They could go so far as to say being elected is fine, but he would be disqualified from taking the oath and becoming president, so in a Trump victory the vice president is the real winner.
So that would mean insurrection would be legal in America. If Biden loses to Trump, I will feel empowered to riot in the same way. Time to get a gun I guess.
Anything resembling a more left leaning insurrection will get a very different response than the last one. You will be murdered by the state on the spot. The feds bombed a civilian neighborhood in the 80s for less than that.
The feds bombed a civilian neighborhood in the 80s
They didn’t bomb a neighborhood…
They flattened an entire block.
This is why we take the “peaceful protest” straight to the supreme Court where the real seat of conservative political power lies.
This is why we take the “peaceful protest” straight to the supreme Court where the real seat of conservative political power lies.
Better get on it or you will be out of time.
I think it’s the judges who should be worried about “running out of time”
I mean, BLM had the space in front of the Supreme Court pretty much blocked off when they decided to march on it. When the patriot prayer event happened, that was 10k plus people descending on the Supreme Court.
I simply do not see that happening.
Let me spell it out for you - January 6th the supreme Court but actually get it done.
Rules for thee
Questions of Legality aren’t being heard here. This is only about eligibility for being on a presidential ballot and the ability of an individual state to determine eligibility and remove the candidate from the ballot.
No. The questions posed by the Supreme Court centered around whether there was merit in allowing any single state, which may have arbitrary criteria and or processes, to effectively eliminate a candidate from the ballot, and if so, under what constraints. Ours a valid question. Where is the line? If you allow this precedent, how might it be abused by others?
States rights only matter when it oppresses women, not when it’s constitutionally legal and valid!
It’s not allowing a single court to decide, the Supreme Court of the land is be reviewing that decision right now. They’re not just going to do that on their own. It has to start somewhere.
You’re now on a list.
“Supreme court seems poised to reject efforts to kick insurrectionist Donald Trump off the ballot over the January 6th insurrection, despite the law saying no insurrectionists can be on the ballot”
Funny how no one claims states rights here.
That only seems to be a Republican talking point.
Because it is not a state’s right to interpret the Constitution as they see fit.
Colorado isn’t interpreting it, merely following it. He’s been found guilty in a Colorado Court for a crime that disqualifies him to appear on the ballot of that state.
To argue otherwise is to argue that states can’t remove teenagers from the ballot even though they’re too young to hold office.
“top constitutional court ready to rule entire constitutional amendment unconstitutional”
wouldn’t be the first time. the 9th in particular seems to mystify our corporate evangelicals in the court.
as is half the second. it’s wild, there isn’t even a punctuation mark between the part that just doesn’t count for anything and the part that’s incontrovertible word of God
This is why voting matters. The SCOTUS is basically an apparatus of the conservatives now, and will be for most of the rest of our lives.
I do not understand the US judiciary nullifying a portion of the “sacred” constitution. Seems like the beginning of the end, to an outside observer. Thanks for all the fish!!
No, no, don’t worry, the Supreme Court ruling that the plain language of the Constitution must be interpreted in ever-narrower ways (except when it helps the right-wing) is totally not troubling at all.
No way man, this is the middle of the end. The beginning of the end was when they introduced legal bribery after dumbing down the general populace for a couple decades.
Can we just get to the end? I’m tired of all this.
Bye, bye 14th Amendment.
Bye bye all amendments.
“Freedom of speech means you can express opinions in your own property, not anywhere in public. And if you rent, that’s not your property.” - SCOTUS 2025
“Freedom of speech on your own property only means you can say what you want inside your home where no one else can hear you” - SCOTUS 2026
“We are listening always.” SCOTUS 2027
“We can read your mind thanks to our mandatory brain implants” - SCOTUS 2028
Free speech zones are already a thing that’s perfectly legal. It’s often used to hide unwanted protestors.
SCOTUS rules that they can overturn amendments.
SCOTUS rules it can choose the next president.
SCOTUS rules it can execute people without a trial.
Any bets on where Clarence Thomas will get to spend his next luxury vacation?
Definitely not Colorado
States that believe he should not be on the ballot should keep him off the ballot regardless of what the Supreme Court says. Fuck them and their corrupt shit.
That’s what Republicans in Texas are doing on the border.
Scotus has clearly demonstrated that it is no longer a legitimate institution. It’s be fine with both sides ignoring them until they can demonstrate that they’ve cleaned house.
Yeah, I don’t know why liberals get so uncomfortable with the Supreme Court being ignored. It’s well and truly corrupt and the institution isn’t going to be reformed through just sticking to the process anytime soon. You can dutifully give them absolute power to decide law whenever they feel like it or you can remind them that they need legitimacy to function. Questioning their legitimacy is a good thing. The Court is political and needs to be treated as a political entity.
The problem being, that will give him the ammo to say the election is rigged. Which is going to happen already. So now, it will give them the ammo to say it’s true.
He’s gonna say that anyway
But he will have evidence to support his claims
Lol no. He doesn’t. He’s not qualified. Period. There’s tons of evidence.
There is nothing I said that even insinuated that he was qualified. I am simply stating it will give him the evidence he needs to say it was fraud.
Tldr:
Their excuse is he wasn’t personally there.
So it’s not saying an insurrection is ok, they’re saying trump hasn’t been proven to have participated yet.
Which is why not holding presidents accountable while in office is bullshit. This shit takes so long thru the courts, a lot can change.
We can’t take a decade to prosecute an insurrection
Except it’s been proven by the courts already.
I wouldn’t count this as over just yet. it makes sense that the judges would reserve their harshest questioning for the side that feels they must upend an election. Even the Liberal justices were wary of that.
They spent very little time on the topic of whether Trump was engaged in insurrection. To me, that means their minds are made up on that, one way or the other. You would think if they were going to let him off the hook based on that, though, they would ask more questions.
I think they will rule that individual states can’t use the amendment to keep candidates off of primary ballots. That much is clear. I wonder if they rule that Trump must remain on the ballot, but cannot serve if he wins – unless waived by Congress. It would make the discussion of Trump’s VP much more interesting.
I hope you’re correct in your analysis.
To me the argument was leaning more into the idea that it would be a violation of Stinky’s rights to prevent him from being in the ballot. I think it’s nuts to say, allow a traitor to run and be elected, then they can attempt to have their disability removed by Congress.
If they rule to overturn Colorado’s decision, they will have essentially nullified section 3.
I don’t think the reconstructionists ever imagined that a large number of people would look at someone who pointed a cannon at the Constitution and say that person should definitely hold office. If section 3 is not self-executing I struggle to see how it could be effectively used in any scenario.
To me the argument was leaning more into the idea that it would be a violation of Stinky’s rights to prevent him from being in the ballot.
Which is an absolute horseshit argument. Is it a violation of the rights of a 33 year old person to say he’s constitutionally ineligible to be President?
No, because that’s literally one of the conditions for office the Constitution requires.
There is no due process violation because there’s no process at all- if you try to overthrow the government that is a prima facie disqualifier for being President. You don’t have to be convicted, the same way you don’t get convicted of being under 35 or convicted of not spending 14 years in the US.
To say otherwise means there’s a lot of dead Confederates the US government owes an apology to.
The main shortcoming of that is that it’s easily definable and determinable that someone is under 35yrs old, or hasn’t lived in the US for 14yrs.
But the definition of participation in insurrection is a little more loosy-goosy, and then you have to be (legally speaking) explicit in what constitutes proof that a potential candidate has participated in such an insurrection. Otherwise it will devolve into anyone accusing the candidates they don’t like of having participated in attempted insurrection.
To be clear, I’m not advocating that Trump should be allowed on the ballot or to be president, because he absolutely shouldn’t. I’m just pointing out that it’s not as simple as saying a candidate is younger than 35.
Yes, you’re absolutely correct.
But Colorado already decided that. The court found, as a matter of fact and using previous judicial case law, that Trump does meet all of the requirements necessary for disqualification under the 14th. It’s not just a single person choosing to keep Trump off the ballot.
Besides that, we literally have
- video of Trump telling his mob that they have to fight like hell.
- video of Trump telling them they’re gonna lose their country.
- video of Trump telling them to go to the Capitol.
- sworn testimony that he tried to go too while the riot was already happening and was only stopped because the Secret Service refused to take him.
- knowledge of what his supporters did after they heard him speak (read: what they believed he was telling them to do.)
I think they will rule that individual states can’t use the amendment to keep candidates off of primary ballots. That much is clear.
But the challenge isn’t that he’s not eligible to run in the primary. The challenge is that he’s not eligible to run for President. So if they rule that he isn’t, and they do it quickly, states will have to leave him off the ballot in September(ish) when early ballots are printed.
I wonder if they rule that Trump must remain on the ballot, but cannot serve if he wins – unless waived by Congress.
If he’s eligible to be on the ballot, he’s eligible to run for President. There’s no mechanism where SCOTUS can say “yes you can run, but we say you can’t be sworn in.” Their only opening is on the eligibility question, which is a simple yes or no.
Their only opening is on the eligibility question, which is a simple yes or no.
It can’t be a simple yes or no, though, because the eligibility restriction can be waived. And the amendment says “No person shall … hold any office”, which says nothing about running for office. There’s nothing that says that waiver has to come before declaring any candidacy.
I would not put it past them to say something like “He is currently ineligible. If he runs anyway, then Congress can wait to decide to waive it until after the election”. Kicking the can as far down the road as possible, in the hopes that Trump loses and none of this is necessary.
The nuance you’re missing is that Congress by 2/3rds majority can vote to essentially nullify ineligibility part of the 14th amendment. So he could theoretically get elected and Congress could vote that he could still serve despite leading an insurrection.
Would Congress ever vote on that? Not a chance. But it still leaves open eligibility, which is the issue. If he could be eligible to be president, can he really be kept off the ballot?
There is a near 0 chance SCOTUS will rule beyond what is in front of them. And in this case that is the question if the states have the right to keep candidates off the ballots for the federal election based on article 14 section 3 as this is the justification that was chosen by colorado.
The subjects that will not be touched in this case:
- what defines an insurrection?
- what does it mean to “engage in” an insurrection?
- did trump meet the above requirements?
It is an interesting question, as this asks if the states have the right to determine the answers to the 3 questions above for themselves.
And this is what the main questions today seemed to be about. Because a "yes, states can define this themselves’ would lead to potentially different answers based on the states… and that seems to be an undesired outcome.
The probable outcome is “no states cannot decide” I doubt they will even a sweet “if not states then who” but probably congress. But then…if congress decides… why can they decide to overrule with 2/3 majority?
And how would this then have worked during the post civil war era? As I said… interesting… I’m curious how SCOTUS will answer… especially the motivation.
And this also allows the conservative judges to leave the 3 questions unanswered for another day…
I mean, yeah it’s disappointing but hopefully a legal case can prove he in incited an insurrection and then states can remove him from the ballot. Then the SCOTUS would have to quite literally just nullify a a part of the Constitution, which would be… not out of the realm of possibilities at this point
The legal case in Colorado already determined he met the definitions of insurrection as known by the authors of the 14th.
Based on a summary of their questions and statements, I suspect SCOTUS will rule that only via a procedure defined by Congress can someone be determined to be ineligible for the Presidency based on the 14th. And only at the federal level.
There was such a procedure defined by law following the Civil War but it was revoked by Congress in the 1940s.
I mean, yeah it’s disappointing but hopefully a legal case can prove he in incited an insurrection and then states can remove him from the ballot.
“Trial was too close to an election. Political. Overruled.”
Fast forward to 2025: Defendant Donald Trump in the Insurrection Case given a Presidential Pardon by President Donald Trump. Matter settled.
Bruh, it’s already been proven he’s an insurrectionist by the courts. Gotta love how SCOTUS thinks it can overrule an amendment.
