I can only imagine how desperate and helpless an entire generation of children feel in Russia right now, with their fathers sent to die in a worthless war.
Probably with a very tribalistic “the world is against us” mentality.
they’re being told they are fighting a righteous war defending Ukrainians from Nazis
And the ones that don’t believe it have to shut up. Imagine being against the Iraq War post 9/11 in the US, but your bullies can get you put in jail.
I don’t know why you are getting downvoted. It’s true and you don’t need to be pro-russian or believe it to acknowledge the propaganda.
What I don’t get is how they can look at the rest of the western world backing Ukraine and not wonder “are we the baddies?” Or maybe they do and that creates cognitive dissonance too big to handle. Or they’re told all western countries are Nazis.
You know the insane amount of Russian bots on western-centric websites? Has to be double that on their own sites.
Meh, leave it to Russia to bungle the whole concept of school shootings. If less than two kids get killed, that’s just a normal school day here in America. And really what is so tragic about kids getting shot? Life is best to those who live the least of it.
Fucking wow, a mod deleted a whole comment chain because it wasn’t directly related to the post. That’s pretty fucked. So much for being able to have any sort of discussion here.
Got it mod. No conversation between Lemmy users. Yes sir. Way to be so much fucking better than reddit, huh?
Yeah, there’s a lot of censorship going on here.
The modlog is nice, but it’s still possible for entire chains to be wiped from view if the post at the top gets removed.
I think we should have the option to see what mods censor. That way everyone wins.
Wtf is this comment trying to say?
Are shootings that occur near a school but don’t involve any students let alone kids really school shootings? Not enough people look at the details of reported “school shootings”. They are massively inflated with events that I would not consider a school shooting.
A quintessentially American viewpoint; that a shooting isn’t that bad because it happened near a school rather than inside.
Embarrassing.
I mean to be fair, it’s a difference between a public shooting and a school shooting. Property law matters. Contact your lawyer today, before it happens to you!
Property law matters
My guy, you’re making that argument to the wrong person lol
How is that any better? So when a shooting isn’t at a school but near it it doesn’t danger the children at all? Is there a magic barrier? I mean ye, it’s not technically a school shooting but it is still fucking mental. The anxiety those kids would feel when they hear shots, “am I gonna die now?”. No child should be afraid like that, the adults are failing them in the States.
As I stated a lot of the school shootings did not involve any children, but you want to still use the arguement of “think of the children!” Most of the shootings could not be verified to have even happened. Most of the reported shootings occured with handguns and not rifles. Most of the shootings involved drug dealing. You idiots are twisting the facts on these shootings as much as republicans twist facts on abortion and it is disgusting.
We have a right to bear arms because ever government wants to become totalitarian and our ability to arm ourselves is the only defense when protecting our right to vote and have democracy. Why did the USSR and CCP disarm their population? Why have successful laws passed to disarm americans only been targeted at blacks and other minorities? Use your head for two fucking seconds and realize that the threat of violence is the only thing that keeps corrupt politicians honest. I am thinking of the kids and praying they still have a democratic government when I die that respects their rights.
Do you really think your little pop gun is going to defeat a satellite-guided drone bomber?
Afganistan and Vietnam won dumbass.
Also ask the many assasinated leaders how things are.
After how many deaths and how many years?
Oh shit guys yeah Phew thanks. We can all relax now. No need to do anything .
https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2018/08/27/640323347/the-school-shootings-that-werent
Or you could stop believing every bullshit thing that the anti-gun groups make up…you know it’s bad what NPR can’t find everything they report as true and calls into question what’s real.
Yes, let’s not rush into to taking any sort of precaution to protect our kids. Much better to have this wild West situation we have going on now just in case me, Clyde, and Peepaw need to go toe-to-toe with the US Government in some sort of hypothetical hyperbolic David vs Goliath scenario. Totes makes fucking sense, dunnit.
As a gun owner, I recognize how absolutely lax the gun laws are. Let them make it harder to buy a gun. It won’t hurt you. At least then I know fucking “Off-His-Meds” Jeb down the street from me won’t be able to buy an AR-15 and mow down my family because my weeds keep “blowing on his lawn” or whatever inane shit he constantly yells as me about.
Maybe you could stop being susceptible to all of the gun lobbyists arguments and learn to think for yourself at some point. I don’t know. That’s just my 2¢. Maybe once you have a kid or grandkid going through school your tune will change.
Exactly. Let’s not even raise a finger to do the minimum amount to stop guns getting into the hands of impulsive kids or men to begin with…lets just give a gun to every motherfuckin’ buttwipe out there and let everyone shoot at whoever they want. Eventually one person will be left, with nothing but a ruined earth to comfort themselves. And maybe that’s truly what should happen, poetically justice speaking.
The only times I see pistols is when I see policemen.
The only times I see machine guns is in the hands of policemen at the airport, or when extremist groups are demonstrating and need protection by the police.
Why would I even need a gun, when hardly any criminal owns one?
The concept of gun ownership is flawed in itself.
There’s nothing inherently wrong with gun ownership. However, there is a shit ton wrong on how we handle distribution and tracking of them. We have more prerequisites for operating a vehicle than we do a firearm, and in a country where we have a SIGNIFICANT number of mass shootings, we are doing SIGNIFICANTLY little to fix the issue.
Gun ownership is totally fine. I bought a handgun and a shotgun on the same day (after someone tried to break in and attack my wife - they didn’t realize that I had just come home from a trip) and was blown away that I could just walk right out the door with them within a few minutes. A rifle for hunting is also not an issue.
Fun fact: handguns are used in mass shootings more often than AR15s. In fact, all rifles, of which AR15s is merely the most popular type, are responsible for ~500/60,000 gun deaths/yr in the US. Probably because, as you may guess, handguns are a lot more concealable than rifles.
Also, be fair about the buying process, you still went through the National Instant Criminal background check system. Sure instant checks don’t take long anymore due to Al Gore inventing the internet in the 90s, but they do still happen and adding arbitrary length does nothing to stop crimes. In fact even if they did, they don’t stop nor are they designed to stop the types of planned attack we’re talking about (mass casualty events), they are to stop “crimes of passion” (guy killing his wife), and there’s some contention that they effectively do that as it isn’t like the couple necessarily receives the proper counseling, so he just picks it up and does it next time he’s in a wife killin’ mood, or if he can’t wait goes all Chris Benoit or that “Stairs” jerkoff.
Sounds like a good reason to highly regulate handguns to me.
They are regulated.
I cannot relate to that. I am 37 years old and I think I have never witnessed violent crime, except in television or on playgrounds (children are assholes to each other!)
Yeah, it was terrifying. Like the guy knew she was there, we had just put the dog outside, so they were obviously watching the house. They tried to kick in the front door, and I ran to the front door have naked and half asleep. The terror slammed full force into me when I realized someone was at our door (could see through glass), and I had no weapon to deal with them. They ran as soon as they saw me. I had just gotten home late the night before, so they obviously knew that I wasn’t home, and the knew that my wife was.
It still wigs me out to this day.
How long does the police need to arrive at your home? For me in case of an active break in it would probably be around 120 to 180 seconds. So this usually only happens when nobody is home, it’s too dangerous otherwise.
Someone stole my e-bike from the back yard. And I have heard of break ins in cellars. But that kind of crime that you describe is very very rare.
Does that mean that gun ownership is a side effect of a security system that has flaws in itself?
No we do not, you can purchase a car at any age, transport it across any state lines, drive it without insurance or a license at any age on private property, and you don’t have to register it once to do any of this.
Yea as a gun owner lol what bullshit are you shoveling?
And that shit doesn’t happen, stop making up bullshit scenarios…not even going to speak on the fact that none of what you said or propose will stop someone from obtaining a firearm. It’s not illegal to sell privately and as you probably know prohibition didn’t work.
So what do you think is going to decrease school shootings? What are you proposing or support that will improve the situation?
We can start with:
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Single payer healthcare
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Ending the War on Drugs
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Ending Qualified immunity
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Properly funding our schools and not just rich white suburb schools.
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Build more schools and hire more teachers for proper pay so the class room sizes aren’t 30-40 kids for one teacher.
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UBI (at least start talking about it) once AI takes over most of the blue collar jobs.
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End for profit prisons
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Enforce the laws already on the books
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Make sure there are safety nets for poor families so the kids don’t turn to violence/gangs to survive.
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Increase the minimum wage
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Recreate our mental healthcare so kids don’t turn to the internet for support. And to help veterans not end up as a suicide number.
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Actively make a law to solidify Pro-choice rights. More unwanted children do not help our situation.
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Banning Insider Trading for Congress
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Term limits
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Ranked Choice Voting so we can move away from a 2 party system
So basically… Fix every other nearly impossible to fix problem first before even deciding to do anything about the actual guns, if anything at all?
And to be clear, by impossible to fix, I mean politically, not that these problems are actually unsolvable.
So you’re plan is to try and tackle something that’s written into the constitution… that’s your goal? Say it’s nearly impossible to do everything else on that list which isn’t written into our constitution…but guns… they’re easier to fix…fucking hell you all are really naive.
Lol fantastic response. And its crickets from everyone else being critical
No, not crickets. Those things sound great, let’s do them. We should do everything we can, and that also includes stricter gun laws.
Not term limits though. It may sound like a good idea, but I implore you to research issues with term limits.
Those are all fantastic suggestions. In my opinion we absolutely should be taking much more drastic measures to decrease school shootings in the meantime, as nearly everything you suggest would still take at least ~15-20 years to see results. Any dead kid is too many and there are way too many school shootings.
And you can end with bringing your gun regulations up to speed to every other developed nation.
Or not because it’s not the guns… it’s our society that needs fixing.
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Nothing will improve the situation until we make a concerted effort to shut down gun manufacturing and distribution, even forcibly removing them from the hands of criminals any way we possibly can. And since the kid-killers at the NRA won’t allow that, the answer is - this problem of mass murder in schools is only going to intensify until everyone’s child is at risk and can no longer attend public schools of any kind. And that’s only the tip of the horrific iceberg of a shitshow that’s coming to our country.
Wow you’re really off the deep end aren’t you…I thought most conspiracy theory nut jobs where mainly right wing…but shit you just went into over drive and leaned hard left on that one…
I am as leftist as any human being ever could be - and damn proud of it. Saying the truth always seems like “going off the deep end” to people who aren’t able to comprehend. I consider your remark proof of that.
It should be illegal.
Or sold with a licensed dealer present and require that it gets properly registered.
With a background check, and a waiting period.
Oooooh…that’s even better.
How about mandatory gun safety training every time you buy one?
Actually with the new proposals to remove firearms from anyone with any kind of criminal background or mental health disorder, and the law being amended to allow this, there are ways to effectively stop people from having firearms. It’s simple humanitarian guidelines that need to be enacted. Only a churlish dolt would refuse to see the common sense of keeping guns out of the hands of men and boys.
Cool, how do you plan to enforce it… cause we all know that drugs being illegal…no one sells those on the black market…
Since you asked me this twice, I will not answer it again. But I will touch on the black market part, no one can enforce the black market and that’s why it’s called the black market. but just because the black market exists doesn’t mean legal market shouldn’t. if you think a firearm shouldn’t have to be registered legally because it’s possible to get it illegally, then you are missing the whole point of laws and civilization, and I’m not really sure why you’re here. 
Registration is a tool for oppressing minorities. It’s racist, and thinking registration is going to magically stop gang violence is hilariously naive.
Just look at counties without school shootings, the answer is pretty obvious: none of them have… video games, mental illness, or Democrats.
The fact that they don’t have an insane amount of firearms, or the ability to purchase them easily and with barely any restrictions, is just a coincidence. Definitely not relevant.
But then they bring up Switzerland’s huge stockpile of guns.
Without mentioning they only have them through military training, meaning they are fully trained on gun safety.
Or that they aren’t allowed to have ammo for those guns.
You had me in the first half ngl.
Not really, just kept getting worst
Hello, I am from the uneducated north, what are these “vid eh oh gams” of which you speak?
They also have safety nets, way less gang violence, not a war on drugs, of for profit prison systems…and a whole shit load of other things, but naa it’s the guns…
Oh shit I forgot that Eric Harris and Adam Lanza both claimed Crips. I heard they C walked down the hallways as they shot up the schools.
I honestly can’t tell if you’re intentionally giving bad faith arguments, or just stupid. But I’m betting it’s the latter.
O shit I forgot columbine happened during the AWB…and so did VT…shit…kinda sounds like I’m not the one arguing in bad faith.
deleted by creator
Their government doesn’t deny the impending climate catastrophe.
NPR is a pretty neutral news source. Your comment on them seems a bit unhinged.
NPR leans left, while they’re not super left, they’re not fully neutal. The point is, a lot of lies get used as truths to spread political propaganda, and it works.
The fucking truth leans left. The fuck do you want? Right wing shit is divorced from reality.
The truth doesn’t have a political side.
Such as?
I’ve seen the opposite lately, actually. They’ve been criticized historically (unfairly, it was just objective reporting) for leaning left, but they’ve since overcorrected and now lean center-right a lot of the time.
News to me, those bias sites are all showing them as light left still, but I’m not saying you’re wrong.
I know what the sites say… They’re pretty reliably in the center. I think the whole “reality has as liberal bias” thing made it seem like they leaned left when in reality, that’s just what the center actually looks like.
From my experience, since I’ve been paying attention, they’ve over-corrected in the other direction. Still mostly center, but they seem kind of scared to be completely objective when it makes the GOP look as bad as it actually is. They seem perfectly OK with the fascist element taking control (who will most likely either do away with all of their funding, or turn it into a state-backed propaganda mouthpiece), because they seem scared that calling people what they are will make them appear “left-leaning”.
Just my observations. Maybe keep it in mind going forward and see if you notice as well.
I’ll have to pay closer attention to that, it would be crazy if they did that though. As you said they’ve already been attacked by the GOP for funding.
I was wondering how long it’d take for the word “propaganda” to show up on Lemmy. 3 seconds flat this time, congratulations!
The worst is the Gun Violence Archive and their “mass shooting index” which gets quoted uncritically in the media, so you get headlines like:
https://abcnews.go.com/US/mass-shootings-days-2023-database-shows/story?id=96609874
"There have been more mass shootings than days in 2023, database shows
The United States has experienced 627 mass shootings so far this year."
The problem is they define “mass shooting” differently from how the public sees a mass shooting.
Their definition is a shooting event where 4 or more people are injured or killed.
So were there 627 events similar to the UNLV situation where a nut with a gun shows up in a public place and starts shooting indescriminately?
No.
Most of the shootings listed on the Gun Violence Archive are situations where there was a party, alcohol or drugs were involved, two parties got into an argument, the argument turned into a fight, and people got shot. That’s not how most people define a “mass shooting”.
I’d argue for a mass shooting definition of “person(s) arrive at a public location with the sole intention of shooting as many people as possible.”
That would rule out the bar fight incidents, or robberies gone bad, or people who go nuts and kill their family in their own house. We should distinguish between psychotic episodes that put the public at risk, vs. normal crime, vs. domestic vioence that does not involve the general public.
So your objection is that they call a mass shooting a mass shooting? What magic number would you like them to use?
No, my objection is they call normal shootings mass shootings with the agenda of making and keeping people scared.
You don’t think the nra telling people to be scared and that they need a gun to feel safe is more of the issue?
Not really, because the vast, vast, number of gun owners don’t use them.
Let me give you some perspective…
We don’t REALLY know, but the best estimate is there are around 474 MILLION guns in the United States.
https://www.thetrace.org/2023/03/guns-america-data-atf-total/
In 2021, 48,830 people died from gun injuries.
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/
54% of those were suicides. So 22,462 murders or accidents.
Gun laws are never going to prevent suicides, only national mental health care can do that. So looking at the murders and accidents:
22,462 / 474,000,000? 0.0000473878
That’s not a crisis, it’s a rounding error. And, yes, each one of those 22,000 deaths individually is a tragedy, but that also means 473,978,000 guns sat around collecting dust.
In 2021, 48,830 people died from gun injuries.
Jesus christ… Let’s compare to other developed nations, wanna do per capita or total?
So far, anti-gun groups have never made up anything. They don’t have to, the stats are there for anyone who isn’t completely ignorant to see for themselves. Two mass murders in the U.S. in the past two days, and this is what you come up with? It’s no wonder humanity is plummeting into mass murder and insanity keeps rising.
Did you even read the article I posted from NPR? It’s literally calling out how bad the everytown info is. It’s made up, and continually used as factual information.
Sounds good, it’s a great day!
And Ajit Pai just joined
NPRThe American Public TV Board of Trustees. I’m not entirely certain if they and NPR are the same organization.so I’m sure the journalistic integrity is going into his giant Reese’s Mug, to be thrown in the toilet.https://indiawest.com/ajit-pai-elected-to-public-television-board-of-trustees/
Edit: found the article, will leave the original text up as the sentiment remains the same, just struck out.
That’s terrible, but that article is from 2019…so not much of shit pie joining means much…still sucks as NPR I really liked, even if they did have a lean on some things I disagreed with.
So Russia can list all of their school shootings for the past couple years with details in a condensed lemmy bot post…… very tragic still but damn it usa needs gun reform legislation nationally.
I don’t think we could list all of our school shootings in the past month this concisely, let alone going as far back as the 2020’s.
I don’t think we could list all of our school shootings in the past month this concisely, let alone going as far back as the 2020’s.
https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2018/08/27/640323347/the-school-shootings-that-werent
We literally can. Because the vast majority of reported school shootings never happened.
Why are you linking a 5 year old article?
So that’s your only argument against my statement? That the article is less than a decade old? Please tell me you have ANYTHING better than that…
Here is a pretty up-to-date one:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_school_shootings_in_the_United_States_(2000–present)
And that list claims 19 during the time where NPR and ACLU(https://www.aclu.org/issues/juvenile-justice/school-prison-pipeline/race-discipline-and-safety-us-public-schools?redirect=schooldiscipline) can only confirm 11.
Hard to trust a list generated by “volunteers” that disagrees with NPR and the ACLU.
Wrap it up folks, not enough people were killed, we can continue glorifying guns!
I’m sorry, where did I say anything akin to that? What a completely disingenuous way frame my point. I’m sorry that your beliefs are so fragile that you can’t actually participate in a reasoned discussion without acting like a fool.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
The 14-year-old girl walked into her school in Bryansk, in western Russia, close to the Ukrainian border, with a shotgun registered in the name of her father, according to local authorities.
“The families of the killed girl and injured children will be provided all the necessary assistance,” Mr Bogomaz said on the messaging app Telegram.
Alexey Kuznetsov, Russia’s deputy health minister, said one victim was undergoing surgery, without specifying details.
In March, the International Criminal Court issued an arrest warrant for Ms Lvova-Belova and Russian President Vladimir Putin over alleged war crimes, accusing them of responsibility for the abduction of children from Ukraine.
In September 2022, a gunman opened fire in a school in central Russia, killing 17 people and wounding 24 others before shooting himself dead.
In May 2021, a man opened fire at students at his former high school in the Russian city of Kazan, killing nine people including seven children.
The original article contains 347 words, the summary contains 153 words. Saved 56%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!
The middle paragraph is so disjoint. It’s only mildly more relevant in the full article.
Russia’s Investigative Committee, which probes major crimes, said the teenager killed one of her classmates and that it was looking into a motive.
Gun was her father’s.
Good news: Russia is adopting western values!
