It’s not just Gen Z…
Yeah, as an elder millennial, I’ve never been able to afford to live alone. This is by no means a new problem, but it’s definitely getting worse.
I worked with a old woman in her 60s with a roommate in 2015. Her salary doesn’t provide for her living alone.
For me, my rent doubled. So Im betting she’s now with 1-3 more roommates since then.
Just got engaged to my long term partner. We live with 2 other people and, with the way things are going, we will be married and still sharing accommodation because 2 full time jobs aren’t enough to cover rent AND food.
My bootstraps can’t be pulled any higher. I work 6 days a week and spend my Sunday working on my web design business to try make ends meet. Thank god I’m paying my landlords mortgage. I can’t imagine how they’re coping at the moment…
Its a clown world.
Depending on what your full time jobs are, have you looked at smaller cities? Sometimes housing is so much cheaper that it’s worth it even if your salary is lower…
Moving from the city I was in to where I’m at now I’ve lost nothing as far as services are concerned and the same house sells for half the price and has a bigger lot…
You underestimate the societal complexity and economic risks hidden behind the verb “move” in this context.
I underestimate nothing, I did it six months ago, do you think I don’t understand how stressful it can be? Either you take a risk or you are guaranteed to continue living the situation you hate, make a choice.
Moving out of home when mum dies, because that inheretance is probably the only way I’ll ever buy a house
fucking sad
Millennials: Uhm, we’ve been living that dream for over twenty years now.
I’m over 40 and literally I have only been able to live alone for exactly four years out of the twenty-three years since I moved out of my parents. I currently live with a partner, because, you guessed it, it’s about the only way we can afford things now.
20 years ago, I could rent a 1 bedroom small apartment for under $1k. Now you’re lucky to find the same for $2.5k. Pay has not more than doubled. They definitely have it worse than us.
In a city of 200k I can rent a two bedroom apartment for about 1.2k and have access to everything I might possibly need (including a job) except an Ikea…
“Well it worked for me so if you can’t do it then you’re just not trying hard enough!” Don’t be intentionally obtuse. There are jobs in major cities.
People also have other shit in their lives you know nothing about. You have no idea what every single person does for a living. Maybe they work for the government and need to be near a military base, or the state capital happens to be a major metro area. Maybe they live near their elderly parents they take care of. Maybe they have family nearby who can watch their kids while they go to work and if they moved they’d have to start paying a ton in childcare. Maybe there’s a cheap private school there and they don’t want to have to switch their kid to public school. Maybe they have a chronic health condition or disability and need to live near the best doctors. Maybe one person went back to college and the classes they need are on campus. Especially if it’s a higher degree where they can’t just go to any community college in buttfuck nowhere. Maybe they had to move there for a postdoc fellowship. But why am I telling you when you already have all the answers.
Nothing new about living in New York being more expensive than Albany.
I met someone who moved to Albany to get an advanced degree and they hated it. They alluded to the fact that they were broke and living with a group of people. Unless you’re suggesting living out in the woods, in which case, sure. You’re right. I’ve heard there’s some great career opportunities out in the catskills.
We have no idea what other people’s lives are like and none of us should assume we do. Especially when you’re going to be a dick about it.
Man, if we were to listen to you the majority of people are living edge case scenarios which makes it impossible for them to find a way to improve a situation they hate!
I met someone who moved to Albany to get an advanced degree and they hated it. They alluded to the fact that they were broke and living with a group of people.And I’m sure they would have hated New York and would have had to live with an even bigger group of people! It’s also completely ridiculous to complain about having to live with others while you’re in school and can’t work a job full time.
The only dick I see here is you, I merely suggested that it’s possible to live in places where you have access to everything THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE needs and to still have inexpensive housing. Not everyone needs to live in cities of a million or more but a lot of people will never consider moving out of them because they never do the math to realise that they might be better off doing it even if it means sacrificing some other things.
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Yeah let’s not pretend it isn’t so much worse now though.
Yes, but it’s worse for everybody. Millennials that have been renting for decades… How the hell are they going to get ahead enough to save up for a down payment!? Meanwhile, housing prices keep rising, outpacing even combined incomes. I realize some people are able to make it work, but I don’t think it’s the majority…
Oh absolutely, didn’t mean for that to be a takeaway. These kids have got it way worse than we do, they were fucked right out of the gate even harder than we did. Just had my Gen X “they forgot about us” moment.
They’ll never forget about us. Someone has to be responsible for things going out of business.
I lived alone for exactly one year before the apartment raised the rent by over %13. I had never been late or missed a payment. Luckily, my fiance, now wife, offered me to move in with her. But I would have had to move soon either way back then because I was being priced out quickly.
I’m over 40 (one of the ancient Millennials)
I think you might be very very late Gen X, TBH.
I think 79 is supposed to be the last year for gen X.
Yea 1980 is the cut off. And I was born in 81 and while I understand the gen x around me, my values align with working class millennials and gen z.
I’ve met so many narcissistic gen x that I’m default sus of anyone older than me. Some of the best people I’ve ever known are gen x. But unfortunately many many more of the worst are too.
Don’t misunderstand, I let everyone introduce themselves to me through their own words and actionn. My priors might register but that shits stays in the cupboard, its not even on the back burner. Knowledge of stereotypes, or behaviours associating shit I don’t like does not equal those things, and everyone comes blank slate.
It occurs to me now that that’s prob a remnant of being raised on the meritocracy mythos. And meritocracy IS a myth, that shit isnt real in the slightest. You can’t point at anything in your field of vision and say there, that’s merit. It’s an illusion, but one that feeds to our innate, internal sense of justice. And if you want to dive into an esoteric rabbit hole, Justice is a much more rewarding one.
Rawls for the win.
81 gang.
This all reads like a middle aged man making excuses for not trying.
Lolololols. K bud. I think that’s a a big leap you’re taking but you do you.
You can take whatever you want from that, I’m not here to change yr mind.
It’s sometimes 79, sometimes 80, but I just barely scraped by on the other side.
I think 79 is supposed to be the last year for gen X.
Definitive cutoffs for generations is stupid anyway. It depends way more on socioeconomic class and region than a single year. A millenial born in 81 has way more in common with an Xer from 80 than a millenial from 96.
Oh yeah, no question.
I’m also 40. Too bad you never figured out how to make decent money in 23 years.
Well, that was a bit elitist.
If that’s what you want to call a guy who learned a difficult trade as a straight apprentice instead of dicking around.
Why are you so bitter, old man?
Let me translate for them:
I got mine, and I’m mad everyone isn’t clapping for me
Nah, more sick of this whiny narrative from people gave up, that’s become so pervasive, people seem to use it to make themselves feel better about either never really trying, staying in a bad situation, or doing drugs till they’re 36 and then wondering why they don’t have nothing.
Gonna blow your mind here. Both can be true! People can make it work with some effort and (even you) a ton of luck, but that doesn’t also mean there’s not A HUGE issue. I guarantee you every single person who is struggling day-to-day, and doesn’t have some kind of reality-altering mental illness, wants to improve themselves. Most people either don’t know how, or have tried and tried and tried and just not been fortunate to find their break. Instead of being met with “ah, man, that’s rough bud. Let’s see if we can figure out some resources to help” though, it’s “get a job, don’t do drugs, pull yourself up with those bootstraps you bought (no handouts here!) And fuckin grind til you get it you worthless maggot!” One of those approaches will actually lead to people doing better for themselves, and it’s not the one you chose.
I’m 39 and I do drugs a lot and I pretty much guarantee I’m more successful than you, given what you’ve said.
Maybe let’s leave the drugs out of this discussion
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C’mon man, that’s a little harsh, don’t ya think? I get that you don’t owe him anything but for real, not everyone’s calling is equally rewarding financially, and you know this, and you know how fucked up it is.
Teachers deserve a wage that allows them to save and vacation every year.
In fact, we all do.
Fast food burger flippers do too. Society could afford it before, that we aren’t doing it now is the result of policy decisions, not some invisible market moral correction voodoo. Workers at Dicks Burgers in Seattle make $21/hr + bene’s and Dicks food is 1000x better than any fast food chain, and cheaper too. The money’s there, it’s just not being spread around.
Good for you achieving your own security, honestly, I mean that. But the scales being balanced is something we all need to work towards. Youre still working class, and right now the games still rigged to make sure you die broke. If we can’t collectively work together to make sure the economy works for us all (cuz what’s the point of a society then? It’s just a fancy meat grinder otherwise), that paramedics make more than minimum wage. I’d like to live in a world where words matter. Where “essential” workers weren’t just sacrificed on the alter of capitalism bc the beaurocratic class got furloughed and are actually treated essential.
Otherwise it’s just a matter of time until another round of Reaganomics or fascists usurp power and either way your union gets busted. Ask the control tower what it’s like when the government doesn’t give a shit about the law, or precident. The law only matters if it’s enforced.
I sure hope you vote for higher local taxes every election. Local elections really matter!
Vote for zoning reform too!
Thanks for feeding into the consumerist “all that matters is the money you make and the things you can buy” attitude that’s doing so well for us all right now! We really need it!
Making a priority in ,ife of not being a renter forever, isn’t consumerism, it’s the ooposite. Renting is peak consumerism.
Making a priority in life to earn more so that you can buy buy buy is pretty peak consumer. Your post made a pretty hefty value judgement at the person above (you didn’t make enough money, so why do you deserve…). Peak consumerism is you have to earn so you can buy. The opposite of consumerism is recognizing that we’re more than our bank accounts, and that people need shelter in order to survive, so let’s make it accessible to everyone.
It is. You just gotta quit expecting to buy in LA, Vancouver, NY without a serious money making plan or go where an average dude can afford. Or just sit around and whine, see how far that gets you.
It’s funny that calling out very real problems is “whining” to some people. There’s absolutely some issues going on with housing prices and wages right now, but Mr(s) GotTheirs refuses to see it. You can be proactive and make progress in your own life while also acknowledging that the game is pretty rigged right now, and having a bit of humility that the GotTheirses at least partially got theirs through some luck.
Also, way to make some baseless assumptions about where I, or anyone, is trying to buy.
Blah blah blah. Its always excuses.
Too bad you managed to make it to 40 without developing any sense of perspective
Or maybe I did.
Are we pretending that millennials are affording apartments alone? Cause I know very few doing that. Moving back in with your parents, though, that shit’s common.
I was gonna say, most of Gen X has had roommates since we graduated college.
The headlines just keep repeating. Insert newest generation and print
It’s getting measurably worse at a fairly predictable clip - boomers had it easy, x/y less so, it’s dark for milennials, and impossible for zoomers/alpha.
The guardrails were removed and wheels set in motion by the boomers so they could more effectively ransack the economy - everything since then has been a consolidation of wealth and power at the direct expense of workers.
Yup, sucks. Had high hopes for COVID removing that problem. Buuut, didn’t take out enough.
Just a reminder.
In 1960, minimum wage was $1.00/hour and the average home was $11,000.
So, national minimum wage is $7 something, so homes should be about $77k, right?
Quick history of inflation in America. President Eisenhower started the US/Vietnam War, and JFK kept it going. Ike and Kennedy both wanted to keep it small, but LBJ made a major commitment of troops and air power to deliver a knockout punch. That turned into a quagmire where the US couldn’t pull out without looking like losers. President Johnson [LBJ] started printing money to pay for the War, rather than raise taxes. Nixon was elected as a peace candidate. Nixon’s Vietnam policy alone is worth several books, but we’ll just talk about the US dollar.
Nixon doubled down on Johnson’s bombing policy; the US factories were working 24/7 to make more weapons. Great, except the money was all paper. When the Arab Oil boycott hit the price of everything went through the roof. Suddenly stay at home moms were forced to get jobs to keep the family fed. In 1968 ‘middle class’ was one job to support a family, by 1980, two income families were becoming the norm.
Then came Reagan. Big tax cuts for the rich were supposed to make everything golden again. In 1980, $1 million was considered a vast fortune; by 1992 it was what a really rich guy paid for a party.
Dang.
The working class has been selling itself out ever since the end of world war 2.
None of the timeline matches up with increases in inflation.
https://media.nationalpriorities.org/uploads/military_spending_since_1940_fy_2024_large.png
https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/Fig-1.jpg
Direct spending on Vietnam starts to ramp up in the mid-60s and draws down in the mid-70s. Inflation, however, goes through a major shock in the early 70s and another one in the early 80s. None of this seems to match any kind of cause and effect we would expect. Further, the real cost of Vietnam was born decades later, as those veterans draw on benefits such as the VA hospital system.
And then we have another big increase in military spending during the Reagan years, but no particular increase in inflation is seen.
Oil costs are the main reason for these shocks. “Printing money” is a naive libertarian approach to inflation which largely serves people who use money to make money (i.e., billionaires) as opposed to people who use their labor to make money. I was just lamenting earlier today how leftists around here have started to absorb libertarian narratives on inflation, and it’s not a good thing.
Que the Iraq war part deux. Immediately followed by the Afghan invasion.
Paid for on credit card. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Don’t forget the giant expansion of the government under Bush² either, the TSA, DHS, Medicare expansion
The aughties fucked over the entire upcoming century. Obama swaging the wall street plutocrats after 2008 with, not just the bail outs, but with relaxing corporate control of rental property is looking really, REALLY short sighted about now
Trump repealing Obama’s DoddFrankLite is gonna come back and haunt us too, when wall street implodes in the inevitable 2008 repeat, because if you can trust a banker to do anything, it’s to suck as much blood out as possible and let the public pay for life support. It’s gonna happen again. Guaranteed.
Suddenly stay at home moms were forced to get jobs to keep the family fed. In 1968 ‘middle class’ was one job to support a family, by 1980, two income families were becoming the norm.
This was not because of inflation, but because women were beginning to be seen as fully human
Frankly between this and “but the money was paper” just makes you sound like some kind of neotraditionalist goldbug.
‘Were forced to work’
VS
‘Were permitted to work’
I’m not sure what went wrong with your brain to not be able to distinguish between these two. You’re responding to someone who said the first version. You clapped back with serious attitude about the second version.
They’re not the same though.
SCB is just a contrarian, block them and move on they aren’t worth your time.
Yes I am aware that this person used slanted and incorrect language. That’s sort of my entire point.
You’ll forgive me for not taking someone, who wants the gold standard and traditionalist housewives back, very seriously.
You funny. I never mentioned the gold standard or ‘traditional’ roles. If you’re going to put words in my mouth, I’d like them with an order of nachos and a fruit punch.
You can still buy one for that, as long as you don’t mind living in Flint and like the taste of lead.
I got one in a niceish area for that. All you have to do is buy a small foreclosure and then spend literal years renovating while you live somewhere else and run up a bunch of high interest credit card debt paying for those renovations. 🥲
Man you just dashed my only last real dream of home ownership with your reality. I was like yeah I’ll just find a fixer upper and make it work. I know better now. Thanks for the heads up.
That’s it? Sign me up.
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‘Abysmal?’ Because they didn’t have computers and air conditioning? Are you saying that improvements in technology are dependent on inflation?
If you think that they were terrible because they were smaller than the average house today, I suggest you look at the tiny houses and multiple room mate situations people are looking at today. In 1960, If you had three house mates you were probably in prison.
I’m a disabled millennial. I live in a dangerous old house with 5 roommates and I am still spending over half my money on rent.
Well there’s you’re problem! You’re disabled, so therefore unprofitable. It’s criminal that you have the ability to live while someone who could make profit for our corporate overlords might not. Shame on you for being a leech on society! (In case it wasn’t obvious, /S)
Disabled people are literally paid just to be alive.
Trying to paint reality as a hellish dystopia only works if you say true things.
Disabled people have to jump through years of hoops for those payments.
Further, the top payout is around $750 a month and they aren’t allowed to generate any kind of income outside of that or they will lose it.
This means they can only afford to live in subsidized housing which can take years of being on a waiting list to access.
We pay them far less than subsistence level and many of them end up on the street because of it through no fault of their own.
For five years I gave change to an old man who begged for change while he waited for his name to come up on the housing availability list. He lived out his car the entire time up to that.
We do not pay them to live. We pay them and go “hope you can figure it out” and kick them to the street.
Jesus Christ, who hurt you?!
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the traditional way of life has been snuffed out by the forces of capitalism. there’s no point trying to live a normal life anymore, we have to forge a new path
Let me stop you for a second.
In North America single family houses became the norm after the second world war, that means you might still have living relatives who weren’t raised in what you think is the “traditional way of life”.
It’s more traditional for North Americans to live in multi generational housing or housing provided by their employer than it is to own their own house and expect to only be two living in it once their kids leave.
Everyone getting their own single family homeis unsustainable and 70% home ownership is an historical anomaly that pretty much only concerned WASPs. It’s the American dream, not the American tradition.
That’s very true. Although it’s also true that forcing people into cramped quarters with one another for long periods exacerbates interpersonal issues, and people need the ability to walk away from one another and decompress.
Whether that’s as simple as having their own room where they can close the door, or having a “third place” where they can go without needing to spend money to decompress and not have to be around others, you can’t just endlessly force people to live together, especially when it keeps leading to domestic violence outcomes.
I agree, for most of history humans lived in shared, community housing, and that’s not a bad thing, however I do think it’s bad to promote the idea that we all need to be crammed into incredibly tiny spaces with multiple people living with them.
It would be different if housing was equitable and we didn’t have billionaires using up massive amounts of housing literally for only themselves while the rest are stuck in tiny boxes that they can barely fit inside. Housing size needs to be an equitable issue, because housing size and cramped quarters is a mental and physical health issue.
Way ahead of you.
The traditional way of life was multi-generational homes. If your goal is to live with as few people as possible, the traditional way of life is not for you. Why are you complaining about having the choice to live in homes with many, many fewer people than was traditionally required?
Lol, what? The American tradition has always, in the last century, been to move out as an adult and work your way up into a house and raise a family. On your own. What hell are you calling traditional? Farmer families from the 1800s?
*The American white and middle-class tradition.
This is completely false and there is 0 data to back it up. There were 3 small blips of young people moving out regularly and otherwise the norm has been not to do that.
He’s probably from Europe where historically a wealthy family of multi generations all lived in one house. Because people wanted to be near their family (cringe)
If I heard “traditional lifestyle” out of context and I had to assume the rest, I’d be thinking about, yeah l, living with your family unless married. Most of the people in the world live like this still.
Big “bUt ThErE aRe ChIlDrEn StArViNg In AfRiCa” energy. How dare someone complain when things could be worse, right? What an ungrateful dick for wanting better just because the previous generation had that, huh?
That’s the point.
Expect things to continue to get worse as long as most people believe the disparity in wealth should continue to grow.
It blows my mind just how many people support this through their rabid worship of billionaires. Not because they love the billionaires themselves, but that they think in some fevered future they too will be billionaires. Well, guess what? It’s never, ever, ever, ever going to happen and every day that passes the now-billionaires are tirelessly working to consolidate money and power to prevent proles from getting foothold. Stop being morons, and stop working against your own interests unless you’re a masochist then go nuts I guess. Leave the rest of us out of it
I saw a quote that I found 100% applicable and will never forget: “Europeans vote as if they will one day be homeless. Americans vote as if they will one day be billionaires.”
US really needs a reality check on which one is more likely.
We believe it’s more possible to claw yourself up to the top in this country purely on the basis of dated propaganda. More Americans believe the “American dream” is possible here because look at the name of it, when the reality is social mobility by every measurable metric is worse here than many other countries.
I think a lot of them see it as a degree of “fairness.” That these people earned it (ignoring the facts that got them to where they are now) and they deserve to keep it. It’s more of a moral thing to them than any real worship, and there definitely is a touch of “don’t let that happen to me.” As if their wealth is at risk.
That’s hardly a new situation.
The only people I know that live alone do so in extremely tiny apartments in unpopular areas.
The only real way to buy is as a couple, and has been for decades.
Yeah no kidding – I moved out of my parents at 18 in 2006, and had a roommate all through univeristy and afterwards until getting married (and I couldn’t afford my current flat without my partner’s salary). Very few people I knew had a place to themselves, and if they did they were either scraping by, or they had help.
You’re literally talking about when you were 18. No shit.
Yeah, that’s been true for most Millennials.
Right, does no one remember the ubiquitous TV show of young, modern life: friends? It had two groups of folks living in threes. Now, yes, their apartments were mansion-sized for New York, but the premise was still there, and that was the 90s. Heck, my boomer mother talked about how it wasn’t uncommon for people she knew on the east coast of the US to live with parents until early 30s. ’
This isn’t a completely new phenomenon, but the percentage of the paycheck it costs to afford housing, even with a roommate, still seems to be on the rise.
Yeah, and that was considered unrealistic living even at the time.
Only by people who didn’t watch the first episodes in which they explain how they got the main-stage apartment.
Everyone that doesn’t live in the free apartment has a very nice job, a roommate, or both (as with Chandler and Joey).
We need a new deal, I mean a new new deal. Because this is getting ridiculous, I’m lying it was ridiculous 20 years ago, now it is just the reason why dystopian fiction is impossible to write, how can you top real life?
What kills me is when you go into the realestate subs and they talk about how they have to constantly increase every year because the cost of everything is going up.
Nah bruh, I’ve had my house for 4 years and nothing has increased at any noticeable level.
Yeah boy am I glad I pulled the trigger on a real estate purchase when I did. My costs (mainly HOA, and to a lesser extent taxes) have gone up very slightly in the last few years, but nowhere near the 30-40% increases I used to get smacked with renting over the same timeframe.
It’s like 1.5-2x as expensive as it was to rent in this (already expensive) area 3 years ago.
I’m determined to never rent again. Landlords are unbelievably greedy.
Square Deal (1908)
New Deal (1933)
I Have Altered The Deal (2024)
This isn’t new. I’m 43 so call me whatever you want, Gen X, Millenial, somewhere in between. I didn’t live on my own (meaning without roommates) until about 10 years ago. And even then, I bought a house with my wife. so still kinda roommates.
Completely off topic, but in the article they say some apartment complexes are offering “private liquor lockups.” Wtf?
Gen Z AND millenials
“anymore” implies that until recently that wasn’t the case
Meanwhile, in Canada, rent prices are so high that basically nobody lives alone anymore.
They just changed the generation in the headline. This has been the case in the US for awhile.
I got evicted this year so I feel it
